The Unspoken Truth: Exploitation in the Music Industry

EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

*DISCLAIMER: Transcripts are created using AI, and may not accurately represent the content exactly as presented. Transcripts are provided as a courtesy to our listeners who require them.

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[00:00:00] Opening Theme
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[00:00:30] Introduction and Welcome
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DJ Sir Daniel: greetings and welcome back to Q points podcast. I am DJ sir. Daniel

Jay Ray: And my name is Jay Ray, sometimes known by my governments as Johnny Ray Cornegay, the third what's happening people.

DJ Sir Daniel: people. Welcome back to Q points podcast. The podcast that is dropping the needle on black music history. 

[00:00:51] Discussing Personal Updates and Podcast Growth
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DJ Sir Daniel: J Ray, how are you doing?

Jay Ray: I am excellent, man. Like, um, it's been busy. Of course, you know what I'm saying? It's definitely been busy, but you know what? I'm really inspired. I'm excited for what we do here at QPoints. I'm excited for stuff that's going on with the family. I'm feeling really good. How are you doing? Listen,

DJ Sir Daniel: very excited to have this discussion. On this particular episode. I'm really happy about the work that we've been doing. The, our social media, you know, outreach and just having a good time, um, making connections with all of you listeners and just growing our listener family because QPoints podcast has something for.

everyone. 

[00:01:40] Engaging with the QPoints Podcast Community
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DJ Sir Daniel: And so this particular episode is no different, but before we delve into all of that, J Ray, please let the new listeners know what they can do to make sure that they are a full fledged part of the Q points podcast family.

Jay Ray: there are so many things, but before I do that, Sir Daniel,

um, for the QPoints 

[00:02:00] Appreciation for Team Contributions
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Jay Ray: family, I just want to thank you, Sir Daniel, for your brilliance and all the social media engagement. No, real talk, like it's, it's a gift that you have. And I thank you for being able to do that for us because it makes a difference. And we see that it's already connecting with so many new folks. So thank you, bro. Thank you.

For 

DJ Sir Daniel: I appreciate that. It's look, it's all for the good, for the good of the Q points podcast.

Jay Ray: yes, yes. 

[00:02:27] How to Support and Grow with QPoints
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Jay Ray: So to Sir Daniel's point, um, you all are already doing the thing that you really need to be doing if you hear us right now, right? So if you hear this message, that means you are listening or watching the show. And that's great. We absolutely need you to do that. Go one step further and left click on the subscribe button, wherever you are, so that you can get notified whenever there is a new episode of QPoints that's really dope. And that's completely free. The other free layer to that, that you can do, and we always say this, um, share it with your friends. Like, Sir Daniel and I recognize that the way that we need to grow QPoints is through all of y'all. So, if you like QPoints, and you're like, I like what those brothers are doing over there. They're not over there talking no foolishness. Share it with your friends, and your family, and your colleagues that you think might be into black music. And the way that we talk about it here. Cause they'll listen to you. Cause you're their friend, or their family, or their colleague, right? So, that's dope. The other thing that you can do, going over to our newsletter. We have, um. Magazine dot Q points dot com. We are about

DJ Sir Daniel: It's so good, 

Jay Ray: it's so good.

It is where we expound on the content in the show. So we will post videos that we kind of talk about music and stuff that we talk about on the show. So you can hear that. So. Stay up with our newsletter so that you can know how to get up so that you could really get in the know and be a cue points insider is so good. So, um, yeah, those are all the things that y'all can do. Thank y'all for being here.

DJ Sir Daniel: Like J Ray said, you gotta stay up so you can get down with the QPoints. 

[00:04:14] Transition
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[00:04:21] Topic: The Predatory Nature of the Music Business
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DJ Sir Daniel: the music industry just based on the way it's set up has been known to divide people who have come into the game as friends, as brothers and sisters and could actually cause. A, um, a division in them and the music industry itself is proving to be a very nefarious and just really icky.

Over the past few weeks, like there has been a reckoning within this industry and a lot of powerful names have been named, accused, um, some very explicit and implicit lawsuits have been made public.

Things that have been done in the dark are being brought to the light at this point and it's a reckoning for certain people, of course, you know, we know all about, you know, Sean puppy combs is his that name is being dragged through the mud. 

Some serious right now.

He's being 

Jay Ray: Allegedly. There's a lot of allegedly with, with Sean, with Diddy, but allegedly, but

yes, all of this is happening.

DJ Sir Daniel: he's being separated from a lot of corporations and stepping, asked to step down from this and that. And, you know, it's, it's a serious thing. People, businesses are separating themselves from him because, you know, Jerry, let's just be real. Um, the name Sean Puffy Combs has had a cloud covering it from the very beginning from the get go.

Like even way back to the City College incident, there has been a dark cloud of energy, bad energy that has followed Diddy around and it's nothing new. We joke about it. We laugh about how, you know, you know, people that get signed to, to, to bad boy records, just never see any money. They end up broke or they get murdered or they die penniless, all types of things.

So, you know, it's, that's not a secret. And I think that it's just one of those things that we now. Um, with Cassie Ventura's very direct lawsuit and, and plain spelling out of incidents that this man has put her through over the decade that they were together, just got us to talking about what is it about this industry that, um, That just states this kind of negative energy that, that encourages and creates people to become Predators, um, especially with people that look like them there's something about this industry that encourages this J Ray. And I, you know, just in us talking, why do you think that this industry is so dang toxic?

Jay Ray: Yeah. Um, a couple of things. So the first thing that comes to mind is the fact that there is so much money to be made in. A complicated industry. That is difficult to understand for most people because of the way the system is constructed, your, your goal is to figure out how to make a coin right off of someone else's talent,

DJ Sir Daniel: Mm hmm.

Jay Ray: but not everybody. Configure out the game. Right? So I think that's one thing, right? Is the industry, the way the system is set up is it encourages people in one way or in one way or another because they're motivated by money to engage in predatory behavior. So that's one

DJ Sir Daniel: Mm hmm.

Jay Ray: The other thing that I think, um, that makes the industry really toxic is, you know, you're just dealing with, we're talking about artists, right?

So we're talking about music. We are talking about the fact that there are going to be folks with a lot of trauma who are brilliant artists, right? We talk about that all the time, whereas they call it the torture genius. Where it's just like, that's just part of it, right? So you end up in shock full of an industry of money, you know, money, grubbing folks, tortured geniuses, people who are incredibly talented and don't understand what's going on it.

And Candy Burris said something recently where she was just like, and also in the music business. There's just like, it's just shady. Like there's just no, there's no rules. You know what I'm saying? So that's why.

DJ Sir Daniel: I think Q Tip said it best, you know, industry rule number 4, 080, record people are shady. To all of your points. You get a industry full of, let's talk about the artists, tortured geniuses, right? Also very insecure people. A lot of times, very insecure because a lot of the artists come into the game at a very young age.

They come in as adolescents when they're not even Fully developed adults, their frontal lobe hasn't even fully developed. So a lot of their executive decisions are flawed because they're not fully formed yet and they're not full fledged adults. So you've got that. And then you got to come, you compound that.

with a majority. And we're going to talk specifically about black music and black musicians and artists. A lot of them come from poverty. A lot of them are already vulnerable because they come from backgrounds that don't allow for them to not turn down a janky deal and 500 up front because that 500 means it's probably the most money they've ever seen in their life and can be Can mean groceries for the family back home as well So there's that And I think I said this on the episode before the music industry is a glamorized pyramid scheme It is ba it is built on the on the um principle of Okay.

I'm going to, I'm going to give you money to go and find two more people to come work under you. And for every person that you bring in, I'm going to give you a bonus so that you can pay them a little bit of money. And then they do the same thing. And at the same time, they're making brilliant music. And, but I'm going to get the lion's share of the money because I'm at the top of the period pyramid and that system.

Like racism and white supremacy, which they both go hand in hand, quite honestly, is built for people not to succeed, not to become billionaires like the people at the top of the pyramid. So what you have, you know, if you, you find these young people and thank you, Meredith, new edition is a great example.

You find, you find five young boys from the projects in Boston. Dirt poor, right? Living in the projects and you, you hit them off with a little bit of money. They're vulnerable. They're out on the road, performing their little hearts out because all they want to do is sing for you and perform for you. And, but they're still adolescents.

So what do you have to do? What do you got to do? You got to entertain them by giving them food, entertain them with all kinds of foolishness, introduce them to liquor. because it helps to calm them down when you need them to be calm. And then there's always somebody lingering around with the, with, with drugs, hard powder, everything you can think of that will either, um, boost you up so you can go out there and perform your heart out on stage or, and when you can't get, when you come on stage and you can't go to sleep and you can't calm down, they got something that'll bring you down.

So then. So if you're already vulnerable and if you have the proclivity to become an addict, guess what? You're now a drug addict with access to a little bit of money, which you are not going to hold on to for a while. So that's just part of the system. It's just built that way where, um, for specifically black people who give of their soul to this, to this art, not to succeed.

And quite frankly, you're worth more money dead to a lot of these corporations than you are alive.

Jay Ray: Bruh. You. Yeah, that's, that's a mic drop. Cause that's absolutely true. Um, I, you said something there that I feel like is really important. Um. When you, when we think about the system as it is set up currently,

DJ Sir Daniel: Mm hmm.

Jay Ray: you, you're already in the whole, if you decide, if you decide that you're going to enter the system, you're going to enter the music business in kind of the, the, big, the big system, right?

You're going to enter

into these big doors, right? Because there is an opportunity. I know a bunch of independent musicians that live really regular lives. They make livings off of their music, but they're not in the big machine, right? They're in their own machine.

That's a whole different experience, right?

We're talking about the people over here in the big machine. If you decide to enter the big machine, you already owe them money. Like you can't, like, you have to make so much money to recoup all of the money that gets spent. Right.

DJ Sir Daniel: Mm hmm.

Jay Ray: We've seen some people like climb out of this, like I'm looking at Beyonce, I'm looking at Rihanna, I'm looking at these artists, but look how hard, let's just take those women, look how hard those women had to work to be in control of their own art.

DJ Sir Daniel: And look how few of them there are.

Jay Ray: Baby, say that.

DJ Sir Daniel: There's, there's not even a handful of artists that can say that have the independence that J Ray is speaking on. And just as you were talking, J Ray, just like predator, we're talking about predatory nature of this. This is predatory lending. A lot of recording contracts are predatory loans, basically.

Jay Ray: that's a quotable. Like record contracts is, is, are like those predatory loans.

Oh my God. 

DJ Sir Daniel: You may, look, you may as well, you may as well be getting your recording contract from a title, 

um, loan place. You may as well, because you are going to have to You are really going to have to make some money in order to get back, um, to make that recoup what it is that they spent on you. And so, you know, we're discussing, we discussed the money aspect, but, uh, we touched on, you know, the whole, um, diddy conversation.

I just, and just veering off of script real quick, I just don't get it. Part of me is like, you know, What these kids go through, you know, the dreams that they have. These are people that look like you that came from the same place you came from. And so I'm just wondering where, along what point do you kind of do you lose your humanity and not look at them as little brothers, little sisters.

You know, from around your way and not try to look out for them in the, in the larger sense of the word,

Jay Ray: And, um, sir Daniel, there are unfortunately just always people who just aren't good people. You know what I'm saying? Like they just aren't. They just aren't good people who are going to do right by folks because they are more interested in what they can get. Um, I think to your earlier point, I think racism and white supremacy encourages it. I think in the sense of American, I think American individualism and exceptionalism encourages it. Capitalism encourages it and yo, people get real. I don't know what it's like to have a million dollars. I don't know what it's like to have a hundred thousand dollars in my bank account. I don't know what that's like, right? Um, there are folks out there that do and what are the, what is the old saying? Um, money is the root of all evil,

DJ Sir Daniel: right? The love of money is the root of all 

Jay Ray: the love, the love. Oh, thank you so much for

DJ Sir Daniel: Cause money is fine. I, 

Jay Ray: I want, I want some of that, but it's the love. 

[00:18:17] The Love of Money in the Music Industry
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Jay Ray: There you go, right? Me and Sir Daniel, we calling it in right? 2024 bring it. But I, you, that love of money thing, that love, the love of the money. So if that's your first thing, if you like the, get the bag first, the people second. That's, we, we always, we need to know when to recognize those people because it will determine how those people interact with you and it will determine what they will do to get the money. And if they need to throw you under the bus to get the money, you done.

DJ Sir Daniel: You're done. 

[00:18:56] The Quid Pro Quo System in Music
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DJ Sir Daniel: And you know, this, the system, the, the, the music system is a quid pro quo system. And it's like, what are a lot of them? A lot of artists are asked point blank. What are you willing to do? To become famous. 

[00:19:15] The Temptation of Fame and Riches
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DJ Sir Daniel: And I think it's, it's almost like that, you know, for those of you who went to vacation Bible school, those of us that, you know, went to Sunday school, Sabbath school and all that, we all heard about the story of, of when Jesus and, you know, Satan were.

We're chilling, you know, looking over the land and Satan was like, you know what, if you just, you know, you just Hank, come, come on my team, get with the winning team, you know, all of this can be yours. And, you know, it was just tempting Jesus with the run of the land and like, and telling him all, you know, I can get you riches.

I can, you know, you can do this, you can be in charge of this part of the world and have the control over this whole world, blah, blah, blah. And. All of us have those moments is in a lot of artists had that moment where the person in charge of the person, the dream, the dream fulfiller comes to them and says, what are you willing to give up?

What do you want to do? What are you willing to give of yourself of your soul in order to get to those riches in order to get to fame? And let's not even discuss the fame drug. Cause fame is a drug in and of itself, but, 

Jay Ray: the fame monster is what, uh, what's her

name? Uh, Lady Gaga. said, 

DJ Sir Daniel: It's so it's like, what are you willing to give? And, you know, quite, quite frankly, a lot of young people again, who are able to make better executive decisions.

Say, you know what? I'm willing to do anything. 

[00:20:53] The Dark Side of the Music Industry
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DJ Sir Daniel: And again, it's just like Jay Ray it's just like working with, um, people that are s*x trafficked You know, you get, they're vulnerable as hell. They don't know where the next meal is coming from. They're disenfranchised from their family. So many things already make them susceptible.

And here you come, you know, flashing the green and the luxury and whatnot. And they're like, I'm willing to do every anything. And that includes. Yes, I'm willing to rehearse and sing and write and do all of that stuff, but I'm willing to possibly Give part my body away And that's a real thing that um a dirty secret that people I think are now becoming more comfortable discussing with regards to this Industry of music.

[00:21:44] The Power Dynamics in the Music Industry
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Jay Ray: you know, I want to thank you for illuminating that because I think one of the things that we've talked about offline, and I think it's important to say here

is that QPoints is a place that one, um, supports black women, believes black women. Um, and just in the greater scheme of things is interested in lifting up the voices of folks who have been harmed, folks who are survivors, et cetera. 

[00:22:18] Transition
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[00:22:25] The Struggles of Women in the Music Industry
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Jay Ray: What Cassie did was really difficult. What Drew Dixon did was really difficult. What all of them sisters, allllll of them sisters that got R. Kelly. Behind bars did was really difficult because these are folks, these are, are, are men that have power resources, money, and more importantly, people that will blindly follow them.

DJ Sir Daniel: I think that's the scariest 

part. 

Jay Ray: That's the, that is the scariest part where, when we take a look, when we take a step back and we hear, and we. I wasn't going to read the 35 pages of Cassie because what I heard was like, you know what? I'm good on that. I don't want that in my spirit, right? But when we think about all of that that goes into all of everything that goes into needing to reveal all of that, we're learning a lot about. 

[00:23:35] The Impact of Power and Influence in the Music Industry
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Jay Ray: In this moment about how people have operated. And I think there's going to be more

DJ Sir Daniel: There's absolutely going to be more and what a lot of people have said. Oh no, I take that back. I said this full transparency. Um, when the Cassie news dropped. I, you know, I was basically like the, I'm, this is not surprising. This particular gentleman, his name has been, there have been rumors following him. I mean, they linger on him more than Sean John Cologne. They have been following him for decades. 

[00:24:09] The Exploitation in the Music Industry
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DJ Sir Daniel: These, these rumors, these myths of sex parties, all of that stuff, and somebody just basically Cosign and say, yeah, if those things are true, they happened to me, but I said all that to say that I was surprised that it wasn't a young man because those have been rumors too.

[00:24:27] The Tragic Story of Milli Vanilli
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DJ Sir Daniel: And it brought got me to thinking about, I just recently saw the Milli Vanilli documentary. Um, is that HBO? Is that 

Jay Ray: Paramount Plus. 

DJ Sir Daniel: Paramount plus. Yes. And I tweeted about it after I watched it, Jerry. It was, you know, because that's like going in the time machine for us because that was a, you know, that was, we were kids when that stuff was happening and it was a great time.

It was nostalgic. I laughed. I danced around a little bit because Listen, the music was kind of fire. The music was still fire. And I went from joy to cringing to straight full on rage. By the time I got to the end of that documentary, because Rob and Fab were straight up victims of a very dangerous and nefarious system, that man, what is his name 

Jay Ray: Frank Farian. 

DJ Sir Daniel: Frank Farian sought them out. Well, he would have saw if it would have been two other people, two other men, young boys, he would have gotten them because historically he, oh, he did the same thing with, um, another black artist. Boney M and he historically would use them use their black bodies To present his music to present his voice to the world But use your black body to present it and use you up and put you on the front line As the face of his music and basically set you up to be the fall guy Which is what happened to rob and fab of millie vanilli They were set up from the very beginning And when when the shit hit the fan jray he backed away had nothing to do with it didn't want anything to do with them um forced them to go ahead and make a statement and When the question started being directed at him.

[00:26:36] The Misuse of Black Bodies in the Music Industry
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DJ Sir Daniel: Oh, well, you know Um, I told them not to do, to perform on the Grammy, you paid for them to perform on the Grammys and it's just, it just incensed me because again, white supremacy, um, the, the, the chattel and use of black bodies and capitalizing on black bodies for their greater good, because who got all the money?

Jay Ray: Baby, Frank

DJ Sir Daniel: Who got paid?

Jay Ray: Frank and

Ingrid. And Ingrid sitting. Okay. Ingrid made me mad. I was like, what you're not,

DJ Sir Daniel: worst.

Jay Ray: what you're not going to do, Ingrid, is how much you loved Rob. Oh, I loved, I loved him. I loved him. I loved him. Really, girl? What you needed to be sitting up in that chair and doing is apologizing for your role in that foolishness?

So, Ingrid, if you see this We're not feeling you, we're not feeling you, we, you should have been apologizing to those men for what y'all did to them.

DJ Sir Daniel: Save those crocodile tears, Ingrid. You know, I think the, the nastiest, the nastiest work that Frank, that, um, Farron did was showing up to the funeral and hopping in front of the cameras. To, to look so stoic and so depressed and so unhappy. Oh, you were loved, Rob. You were loved, Rob. I'm like, get the, get the out of here with that.

You know, just, just so unfeeling, just so unhuman and just, and nasty. Just a lot of nasty work when it comes to what happened to those two young men.

Jay Ray: Yeah. 

[00:28:17] The Dangers of Seeking Fame and Success
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Jay Ray: You, um, you brought up a really important and, and this is the, this is one of the things about the, the, the, the entertainment industry. Thank you Meredith for saying that. Cause this is really, truly the entertainment industry as a whole, right?

DJ Sir Daniel: As a whole, yeah.

Jay Ray: But. We end up doing the same thing that that white man did to Robin Fabb to our own people.

You've already said this, and I think it's really important to underscore that Frank Farian did, had already done it with Boney M.

Cast them out, right? Um. Bobby Farrell was broke and had fronted that band for years, fronted the band, right, because it was really,

of course, Frank Farian's, uh, voice. Um, but then, okay, then he comes back and he does it again with Milli Vanilli, much bigger scale. And somebody made the great point of, oh, no, no, no, no, the Milli Vanilli train would have Would have continued had that man not put them who ain't know nothing had he put them in for the grammy thing

And he's that way. Oh that white man was so like why don't y'all want these people to win a grammy? Baby, you don't

know that they not singing.

You know, It's a great song.

blame it on the rain

Why don't 

DJ Sir Daniel: you know, he was, he was a, he was an infant in the industry. He was like, you know, this is a great song. I think we should do this, and little did he know, little did he know

Jay Ray: did he know

[00:29:51] The Harm Done in the Music Industry
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DJ Sir Daniel: what he was doing. Go ahead.

Jay Ray: right and where I wanted to get to which was really Cuz I didn't remember this cuz I checked out of the Milli Vanilli train after Robin Thad I didn't know that Frank Farian like dropped a real Milli Vanilli album like right after that and did the same Thing

DJ Sir Daniel: With two newer, 

Jay Ray: with two new people Do he had he had the the people who sang and then these two new people Out front who ain't had nothing to do.

They ain't say nothing. They just in the group

DJ Sir Daniel: lip syncing. Again, all he cared about was that, oh, they're black, 

Jay Ray: They're 

DJ Sir Daniel: they look good, and they can really move, Which is,

Jay Ray: They can really move

DJ Sir Daniel: you know, which is just debasing us to the, again, to natural physical attributes, which has been happening since, you know, we got into onto the ships and across the transatlantic because of physical attributes.

Always, always just being reduced to just physical prowess, physical attributes, physical gifts. We continue to be used for our gifts in this country. 

[00:31:07] Mid-Roll: TROY Podcast
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DJ Sir Daniel: sometimes. 

[00:31:52] The Need for Change in the Music Industry
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DJ Sir Daniel: I play records, I spin records, and I think about these, the voices behind some of these records, and I'm just like, God, what kind of sacrifice did you do for us, give for us to, to play these records, to, to dance to them, to, to play them at our barbecues, to play them at graduations.

That's why I, I hold. So artists and music to such high regard because it's covered in blood It was made with blood and I can't disrespect. That's why I get so disgusted when other black black young people Disregard and throw away artists from a different era just because they're from a different era and they feel that they're irrelevant When in fact the road that you're walking on has been paved with their blood, you know So, so yeah, I, it lends, you know, that Robin fab moment really lent to this discussion, you know, and earlier we were just talking about the whole sex and sex, sex aspect of exploits to the sexually exploits of nature of the industry, you know, we've seen it, you know, it's not just in pop music.

It's not just. You know, R& B is happening, hip hop, you know, uh, I remember when the Roxanne, Roxanne movie came out, you know, she had a record on the, on the air, on the radio, but was still homeless. And you know, was told that, Hey, if you need to stay here, you got to pay to play. So imagine you're 15 years old.

You're trying to, you know, you're, you're out here trying to make it in this business, but you don't have any place to stay. Cause you've got put out from the house and you're dealing with that. You're dealing with pay to play. You're dealing with having to have survival sex in order to just live just to, to.

To have your basic needs met. And then you have it on that level. And then you get to another level, like a Cassie and a Diddy situation where it's like, okay, I'm going to sign you to a 10 record deal. record deal.

but I'm going to, I don't know, it is, this was definitely a, really a personal thing. The things that he, he was, he's alleged to have done to her was really stuff that was done on a personal level.

Also making sure that she couldn't prosper in any other forms of entertainment, making sure that he kept a thumb on her for the rest of her life.

Jay Ray: Yeah.

So I think the thing that is really important is what you're saying, because here's the thing we need to remember about this Cassie situation. Her career died after she started dating. Like he literally killed that woman's music career, but she was signed to a 10 album deal. So even if they stopped dating, she would have still had to deliver y'all nine. I think it ended up, cause I think it was like a second one somewhere. So eight, eight other albums. If you do an album every two years, that's 16 years.

DJ Sir Daniel: And. And knowing that all the while knowing that her, um, presence in the industry as each year goes by is being eclipsed by newer and younger artists coming out every single year, you've got, um, you know, these titans of the industry that are, are, are rising up to their superpowers. So where does Uh, Cassie fit, where does identity cane fit, you know, in this whole landscape of music.

And when you keep, when you, the person that could actually benefit from their pros, their prosperity is keeping them down basically, because for whatever reasons, we don't know, but like separating them from. You know other producers and people that can help them and curate this sound because quite honestly We fell in love with the cassie sound because of her relationship with ryan leslie laptop mysteriously disappeared, by the way 

Jay Ray: baby, we ain't never we ain't never found Ryan Leslie's music.

DJ Sir Daniel: music on that laptop, but Just to you know, there's just so many

Jay Ray: Mhm.

DJ Sir Daniel: Again, you spoke of Drew Dixon at the top and how her, her documentary really was the lead domino in this effect of, you know, women in the music industry, specifically black music industry, speaking up about the atrocities that they were facing at the hands of the men, the brothers who are supposed to be, who are supposed to be looking out for them.

In this industry. And in fact, using their power and let's talk about that. Jerry using their perceived power to. Control them, basically. And we see that happen outside of the music industry, right? We see, you know, people in this society, let's take black men for instance, you know, try to exert some power in this white supremacist structure, and what do you do when you're trying to build power to Um, execute power.

You pick on somebody that you feel is less than you. So you pick on, you pick on women because they're the closest to you, right? You pick on the people that have the most proximity to you. So you pick on your, your wife, your girlfriend, your sister, you pick on them and you do whatever to them and talk about them.

You pick on, uh, the gay people, um, because they're, they're also in close proximity to you in the, in the community, specifically in a black community. So you pick on them and you assert your dominance in the way that you feel Puts you ahead puts you closest to power the white supremacy power structure Um that has been built within this country So I think that's what translated translates into the industry then of course, you know You got some of them that are just naturally dickheads, you know, there are you know creeps That should have those kind of inclinations already.

[00:38:47] The Aftermath and Consequences
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DJ Sir Daniel: And so you give you mix that with money Some power, some powder And you got a wicked storm happening to a lot of women in the music industry

Jay Ray: Sir. Sir Daniel. I think that's the archetype. Like, I think, and I've noted, I'm gonna use an I statement. I've noticed this years ago, just watching how people move. There is an archetype. And I think all of those things that you're described, all of those things you've described, I actually truly believe that. Many of these folks are just like not good folks, like just because to do some of the things to do any of the things that when we're talking about these, these, these men specifically, I don't know what kind of human being does things that they're accused of. I just don't know. So I think it's just, um. Some of these folks that just not good folks, you know what I'm saying?

And they're in an industry that doesn't have some of the same checks and balances.

There's a lot more ability to make a lot more money and that money, um, get you to a certain level of power, a certain level of power because

you ain't getting to the top of the pyramid, right?

DJ Sir Daniel: But you are rewarded. 

Jay Ray: But you are rewarded.

You are rewarded though. So enough that you are able to excel. So yeah, I think what we are also learning is just that some of these folks it's like yo, I don't know what kind of human being you have to be to do what some of the stuff you're accused of doing is that's crazy. I

DJ Sir Daniel: It's crazy. It's ridiculous. But I think, yeah, to your point, we can see the handful of people that didn't make it or don't make it because they're, we had that, that nice guy discussion, right? You know, for lack of a better example, let's use Ruben stutter. Ruben stutter was supposed to be America's next eye, next idol, American idol.

And he came and he went You know, wonderful singer was supposed to be set up to be the next Luther Vandross and all that other stuff. But he did not possess a certain swagger, uh, and maybe even a certain nastiness to him, you know, like an Aaron Hall, whose name has been coming up a lot recently as well, you know.

He didn't, he didn't possess that kind of, um, stereotype that America loves of a black man that relies solely on his, his power, which is primarily, um, derived from his sexuality and his prowess and his ability to dominate in those types of things. So. It's just really, it's, it's, it's, it's really kind of sad that maybe you can't succeed in the industry unless you're a little bit of, you have a little smidgen of asshole in you, you know, you gotta be, we, we tend to, and we tend to.

Um, cheerlead the asshole. We tend to like those kind of people. They might be, you know, we're always like, yeah, you know, that's a wild boy. He wild, but you know, I rock with him. I fuck with him. I like that music, but he, he a wild boy, but you know, that's kind of because you kind of wish you you're living vicariously through him is what it is.

Jay Ray: you know what that you are absolutely right. That's another mic drop moment because that's true. Um, and I think that yeah, folks idolize and admire. We got to rework this. We got to change the way that we we got to change the way that we hold people up because they achieve a certain level of success and money in this white. Power structure because I'm telling y'all something in that milk. Don't be clean all the time

You know what I'm saying?

And I'm not saying that You wanted to get your bag is not okay I'm not saying that get your bag cuz I'm gonna get my DJ Sir Daniel gonna get his bag, too But what I am also saying is that we can see that within the system, there's a certain person that gets let in the door,

right? Um, and with the way them folks move, there's an expectation for how you move too. We have to, for Black folks, we have to rewrite what all of that means for us. And, and to some of the, and to all of these cases actually that we're talking about, there's so much harm that has been done. This is like, A lot of harm. Um, and I'm, I'm, I'm not one of those, uh, mass incarceration, like throw everybody in jail sorts of dudes. But I also will admit, I don't know what the restorative justice for the harm that some of these folks have experienced. I don't know what the answer is, but what I, but what I know is, um, it's bad,

it's bad and it needs to be. We have to, as a community, reckon with the fact that, um, these folks have been allowed to, um, in most cases, kind of prosper and, um, get all, get to this level of, like, power and influence, because I think it's a problem.

DJ Sir Daniel: That's a big problem, and I think, you know, before you all get started, Diddy was not about to buy NBC. You know, that's just not, that's 

Jay Ray: But he was about to buy BET. Remember that was a thing?

DJ Sir Daniel: wait, 

no, that was 

Jay Ray: he? It was Tyler Perry. it was Diddy, and it was, I feel like, oh, and I feel like Byron Allen was in there too. I

DJ Sir Daniel: definitely Byron Allen. Right. But the difference is, so here's what we can, what we can do, I believe is we can lift the names of those or at least lift the sisters up. Um, and, and the brothers that have been victimized because too far too many people have been, um, victimized in this industry and they become punchlines.

But think about, I'm thinking about like to this day, Patti LaBelle is a survivor, She's a true survivor of this industry and look how beloved she is. But she has been very clear that she was a victim of sexual assault very early. In her, in her, um, in her quest to, to stardom, um, by another musician, you know, it happens quite a bit.

Again, drew Dixon in her, um, documentary, sherry share from the Mercedes ladies it very early in the, in the hip hop game on the verge of becoming a great, the first, probably the first A female hip hop group to get signed to a major record label. But that was derailed because of a failed, uh, because of a sexual assault, um, incident 

that's documented in the, in the documentary as well. Then you, there's countless women that have probably have gone through that, have, have had some type of assault, you know, and, and countless brothers too, who probably just don't want to be named at this point, 

Jay Ray: that's a really important point too, because I do think we need to, as a community, Um, make space for black men and boys

to tell, to be able to talk about the, um, the abuse that they experience and not judge them for it. Um, because there are probably countless men and boys that we have not heard from because they're afraid for whatever reason. Um,

DJ Sir Daniel: it's so funny. You said that I'm sorry. I just had to say this on that, to that same point, 50 cent has been in his own way, making this a punchline and bringing up his encounters with Diddy about, did he take wanting to take him shopping and using that as a punchline now as saying In his own way, kind of saying, Oh, that sh that shit would've never happened with me, cause I'm a real man.

And that would've never gone down with me, because I'm a real man. But what he's saying, and I don't know if I don't even think he realizes it, when he says things like that, and he makes light of the situation, uh, uh, and jokes about, Oh, you need to go and take somebody else shopping, that's not gonna happen to me.

And it's kind of making whoever that young man is, that's in the studio right now and being manipulated in whatever way, not be able to not feel comfortable to speak up to Jay Ray's exact point. And because nobody, people isn't making space for our young man, for our boys to speak up if they're being mistreated and mishandles, especially in the entertainment industry.

Jay Ray: Sir Daniel, I think, and this is, this is hard y'all because there's going to be a whole lot of people that we love and would be like, probably sitting here thinking like,

no, um, I think the domino has already, it's already way down the way and we have a lot more. illuminating that will happen over the next few years. Mark, I think said way back in the beginning in the chat that the whole decade is going to be trash. I think we're going to be

DJ Sir Daniel: It's gonna, it's gonna be pretty awful. But to, like J Ray was saying, I think this is also an opportunity for, for all of us to be aware. You know, grooming, grooming is a real thing. Uh, if you don't know what grooming is, grooming is. Is somebody in power targeting, pinpointing somebody who is vulnerable that could, that could easily be manipulated to do whatever they want easily manipulated through the means of, um, financial insecurity, food insecurity, uh, homelessness, whatever it takes, or not even those bad things.

Maybe just somebody who wants to be in the end crowd and wants to be accepted. There's a lot of, there's a lot of grooming that takes place. So I think as a community, we have to be aware of what grooming looks like and, um, and the ways that it could be perpetrated right in under our noses. And also wanting to make sure that we show love to all our kids.

And give them and make sure that not only are we providing for them, you know, food, clothing and shelter, but also making them feel like they're enough for who they are and that their bodies don't have to be placed on the auction block. Um, and it's so hard because we love what we do as musicians and artists.

That we want to keep that part of it going, but we really have to extract that nasty little bug, that nasty little infestation that has been plaguing us for decades, for centuries now in this industry that of music and entertainment on a whole. So, um, I think this has been a really good episode, J. Ray, and I think this is something that hopefully will spark conversation, you know, magazines, television shows, holla at us.

You know, you want some of this QPoints juice to be on your show. All you got to do is holla at the folks at QPoints. com and we will be there. 

And Jerry, how else can they make sure they stay in contact with us?

Jay Ray: Listen, thank y'all so much. Yes. Um, 

DJ Sir Daniel: ooh, somebody brought up gospel music. You know what gospel music is a whole nother animal. And it's probably just as, it's probably not just as bad, but maybe even worse. 

Jay Ray: baby, my goodness. We would get dragged. Oh, they would be dragging us. Oh my God. Okay. But we're not going. Okay. Yes. Yes. Yes. To that. Um, but okay. Staying up with cue points. Uh, so, so gospel came up in the chat. For those of you that are listening, you might be like, what happened? Gospel came up in the chat, y'all and, um, lots to discuss there, but, uh,

DJ Sir Daniel: Lots of nasty work in there 

Jay Ray: that's a nasty word. But, um, so y'all are doing the right thing. Y'all are here with us. Y'all are watching us. Y'all are hanging out. That's great. Thank you for doing that. That's the most important thing is free. Subscribe. 

DJ Sir Daniel: So thank you for hanging with us. It's a very serious subject, but that's what we do here. We talk about the fun stuff, but we also talk about the difficult things. But what do I also always say, Jerry, in this life, you have a choice. You can either pick up the needle or you can let the record play. I am DJ Sir Daniel.

Jay Ray: J Ray, y'all on

DJ Sir Daniel: podcast, dropping the needle on black music history. We will see you on the next go round. Peace.

Jay Ray: the next go round.

[00:52:51] Closing Theme
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